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Numbers 20:13 (with my own, loose translation): הֵמָּה מֵי מְרִיבָה אֲשֶׁר רָבוּ בְנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל אֶת ה׳ This was the Fight Water: the Jews fought God The word "רָבוּ" ("fought") has its str...
#3: Post edited
by
msh210
·
2022-07-17T04:12:18Z (over 2 years ago)
- Numbers 20:13 (with my own, loose translation):
- > הֵמָּה מֵי מְרִיבָה אֲשֶׁר רָבוּ בְנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל אֶת ה׳
- >
- > This was the Fight Water: the Jews fought God
- The word "רָבוּ" ("fought") has its stress on the last syllable, _ra-VU_, rather than the first, _RA-vu_.
This would seem to imply that its root is רבה. The verb with root רוב/ריב would have past tense _RA-vu_. (I can't find a good Jewish source for this fact, but Gesenius implies as much in §§[72b](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/72._Verbs_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%95%D6%BC#GHGpar-72-b), [73a](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/73._Verbs_middle_i_(vulgo_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%99)#GHGpar-73-a), [75h](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/75._Verbs_%D7%9C%D7%B4%D7%94#GHGpar-75-h). The context surrounding those will prove helpful to understanding them.)Yet all the commentaries seem to read the word as from the root רוב/ריב, "fight" (as indeed seems obvious from the context).- What gives?
- ----
- (I've checked various commentaries, including מנחת שי,‎ הכתב והקבלה, and העמק דבר, but have found no explanation.)
- Numbers 20:13 (with my own, loose translation):
- > הֵמָּה מֵי מְרִיבָה אֲשֶׁר רָבוּ בְנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל אֶת ה׳
- >
- > This was the Fight Water: the Jews fought God
- The word "רָבוּ" ("fought") has its stress on the last syllable, _ra-VU_, rather than the first, _RA-vu_.
- This would seem to imply that its root is רבה. The verb with root ריב would have past tense _RA-vu_. (I can't find a good Jewish source for this fact, but Gesenius implies as much in §§[72b](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/72._Verbs_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%95%D6%BC#GHGpar-72-b), [73a](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/73._Verbs_middle_i_(vulgo_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%99)#GHGpar-73-a), [75h](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/75._Verbs_%D7%9C%D7%B4%D7%94#GHGpar-75-h). The context surrounding those will prove helpful to understanding them.)
- Yet all the commentaries seem to read the word as from the root ריב, "fight" (as indeed seems obvious from the context).
- What gives?
- ----
- (I've checked various commentaries, including מנחת שי,‎ הכתב והקבלה, and העמק דבר, but have found no explanation.)
#2: Post edited
by
msh210
·
2022-07-17T03:43:15Z (over 2 years ago)
- Numbers 20:13 (with my own, loose translation):
- > הֵמָּה מֵי מְרִיבָה אֲשֶׁר רָבוּ בְנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל אֶת ה׳
- >
- > This was the Fight Water: the Jews fought God
- The word "רָבוּ" ("fought") has its stress on the last syllable, _ra-VU_, rather than the first, _RA-vu_.
- This would seem to imply that its root is רבה. The verb with root רוב/ריב would have past tense _RA-vu_. (I can't find a good Jewish source for this fact, but Gesenius implies as much in §§[72b](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/72._Verbs_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%95%D6%BC#GHGpar-72-b), [73a](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/73._Verbs_middle_i_(vulgo_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%99)#GHGpar-73-a), [75h](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/75._Verbs_%D7%9C%D7%B4%D7%94#GHGpar-75-h). The context surrounding those will prove helpful to understanding them.)
- Yet all the commentaries seem to read the word as from the root רוב/ריב, "fight" (as indeed seems obvious from the context).
- What gives?
- ----
(I've checked various commentaries, including מנחת שי and הכתב והקבלה, but have found no explanation.)
- Numbers 20:13 (with my own, loose translation):
- > הֵמָּה מֵי מְרִיבָה אֲשֶׁר רָבוּ בְנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל אֶת ה׳
- >
- > This was the Fight Water: the Jews fought God
- The word "רָבוּ" ("fought") has its stress on the last syllable, _ra-VU_, rather than the first, _RA-vu_.
- This would seem to imply that its root is רבה. The verb with root רוב/ריב would have past tense _RA-vu_. (I can't find a good Jewish source for this fact, but Gesenius implies as much in §§[72b](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/72._Verbs_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%95%D6%BC#GHGpar-72-b), [73a](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/73._Verbs_middle_i_(vulgo_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%99)#GHGpar-73-a), [75h](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/75._Verbs_%D7%9C%D7%B4%D7%94#GHGpar-75-h). The context surrounding those will prove helpful to understanding them.)
- Yet all the commentaries seem to read the word as from the root רוב/ריב, "fight" (as indeed seems obvious from the context).
- What gives?
- ----
- (I've checked various commentaries, including מנחת שי,‎ הכתב והקבלה, and העמק דבר, but have found no explanation.)
#1: Initial revision
by
msh210
·
2022-07-17T03:19:02Z (over 2 years ago)
Why ra-VU in Numbers 20:13?
Numbers 20:13 (with my own, loose translation):
> הֵמָּה מֵי מְרִיבָה אֲשֶׁר רָבוּ בְנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל אֶת ה׳
>
> This was the Fight Water: the Jews fought God
The word "רָבוּ" ("fought") has its stress on the last syllable, _ra-VU_, rather than the first, _RA-vu_.
This would seem to imply that its root is רבה. The verb with root רוב/ריב would have past tense _RA-vu_. (I can't find a good Jewish source for this fact, but Gesenius implies as much in §§[72b](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/72._Verbs_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%95%D6%BC#GHGpar-72-b), [73a](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/73._Verbs_middle_i_(vulgo_%D7%A2%D7%B4%D7%99)#GHGpar-73-a), [75h](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gesenius%27_Hebrew_Grammar/75._Verbs_%D7%9C%D7%B4%D7%94#GHGpar-75-h). The context surrounding those will prove helpful to understanding them.)
Yet all the commentaries seem to read the word as from the root רוב/ריב, "fight" (as indeed seems obvious from the context).
What gives?
----
(I've checked various commentaries, including מנחת שי and הכתב והקבלה, but have found no explanation.)